Hey all, this is a reply to a topic that my friend Lance is debating with his friend Mark. Anyways, I sorta sum it up at the top so you can catch whats going on. Hope your all having a great day
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Yeah, sorta got side tracked. For your current topic I would say that your not distinguishing between roles. Lets start with a bigger question, can Christians who are leading a country go to war (lance’s position) or should the avoid violence at all cost (Mark’s position)? I am putting the question this way because if it’s ok for the leaders then it would be ok for the men and women under them.
Firstly we will look at the New Testament, Romans 13:3-4 says …
For rulers are not a terror to good conduct, but to bad. Would you have no fear of the one who is in authority? Then do what is good, and you will receive his approval, for he is God’s servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword in vain. For he is the servant of God, an avenger who carries out God’s wrath on the wrongdoer. (ESV)
Two things about this passage I would like to point out. First it says that the government is God’s servant. This means that the government does not have unlimited power but can only do what God has given it the right to do. Secondly it says that “does not bear the sword in vain” One of the things that God has given the government the power to do is to punish people who commit crimes. So we see that a person under the authority of the government can commit a violent act and still be within the guidelines of Scripture.
Now I will assume that with the previous point made you will not have a problem with Christians in the army who would defend the home land. For clearly one of the God given rights of a nation is to defend it’s people. So instead lets focus on the question, is it ever ok for a nation governed by Christians to be the aggressor in a war? One does not need to look far into the Old Testament to find the answer to this question. The book of Joshua is a book of war, King David was a warrior and yet is called “a man after God’s own heart”. We also see times when God used un-godly nations to judge Israel, the time of the exile with King Nebuchadnezzar is an example of this.
I hope this helps. As to whether or not the war we find our selves in right now is a legitimate war or not, I do not know. I’m sure people will be arguing over it for a long time. But God knows the hearts of men and He will judge them accordingly.
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Now I would like to address some of the scripture that Mark brought up. He quoted Matthew 5:38-48 as a reason of who a Christian could not be in the army
“You have heard that it was said, ‘An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth.’ But I say to you, Do not resist the one who is evil. But if anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also. And if anyone would sue you and take your tunic,let him have your cloak as well. And if anyone forces you to go one mile, go with him two miles. Give to the one who begs from you, and do not refuse the one who would borrow from you.
“You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ But I say to you, Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, so that you may be sons of your Father who is in heaven. For he makes his sun rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the just and on the unjust. For if you love those who love you, what reward do you have? Do not even the tax collectors do the same? And if you greet only your brothers,what more are you doing than others? Do not even the Gentiles do the same? You therefore must be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect. (ESV)
I put these two together because the answer is the same for both of them. These verses deal with a personal level not a national level. We have already established from Romans 13 that the government has the right to punish people for crimes. What these verses tell us is that I should not personally seek to punish some one who has wronged me. Not only that, but that I should love people who have wronged me and pray for them.
Mark also brought up Luke 22:47-51 it’s where Peter slices off one of the high priest ears. For this I’m just going to point of the fact that Peter, one of the twelve chosen, had a sword. If Jesus was preaching complete abstinence from violence not matter what, then why did Peter have a sword?
He also asked the question “Who would Jesus Kill”. I don’t see the point of this for Jesus was not acting as a political leader but as a spiritual one. But I’ll go with the question anyways, in the book of John we are told that Jesus is God that he has always been God and always will be (John 1). So as a Christian I believe that Jesus is God and so anything that God has done Jesus has done. Given that I will just point out the Passover (Exodus 12) as a time when Jesus sent the angel of death to kill every first born in Egypt.
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Sorry about how long this was.. I have not gotten to write in a while and it felt good
Anyways, hopefully now we can get back to the point, is Debbie Wasserman Schultz despicable or is Lance just a anti-Semitic sexist???
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